CANBERRA, ACT, April 1 -- The Treasurer of Australia issued the following transcript:
Note
Subjects: support for small business, May Budget, resource taxes, fuel excise, Donald Trump
Kieran Gilbert:
Jim Chalmers, thanks for your time. Amid this oil shock that's continuing, a lot of households and small businesses as you've touched on today are feeling it. What is your message, first of all, to the Australian Tax Office?
Jim Chalmers:
Well, we've asked the Australian Tax Office to be as supportive as they can, as reasonable as they can, particularly when it comes to the pressures that small businesses and others are under as a consequence of this war in the Middle East. The Australian people and Australian small businesses didn't ask for this war, they didn't decide make the key decisions about this war, but that they are paying a very hefty price for it. So what we've been doing is working around the clock, including with the business community, unions and others, to make sure we're doing what we responsibly can to help people through and the ATO measures that we announced today are part of that.
Gilbert:
I saw you were with the banks and big business. You have been saying I'm going to use the stick if needed, with the ACCC and the fuel retailers. But it seems to me that the message today is about more that you want the business community to come together and show leadership. Is that the message today? Because I know you've said look we'll use the stick if needed, but it seemed like a different tone today.
Chalmers:
All of us in positions of authority, positions of leadership, the onus is on all of us to step up and step in where we can to help Australians and Australian small businesses through this difficult period. If you think about what unites our efforts on supply, distribution, cracking down on rip offs, helping with the cost of living. Really, what all of that is about is working through serious issues in a serious way, doing what we responsibly can to help, recognising Australians didn't choose this war but they're paying for it. The consequences will linger for a bit longer, even after the war ends. And so there's a premium always, but especially now on working together, and that's what today's announcements are all about.
Gilbert:
Yeah, indeed, and you've got the Budget coming up. I know this obviously takes on a different complexion given the crisis, but you've got former Treasury Secretary, Martin Parkinson, urging you not to miss the opportunity to deliver reform. Will you heed that warning from him?
Chalmers:
That's my view, too, and I've expressed it in very similar ways to Martin Parkinson. I've got a heap of respect for Martin. I've worked closely with him for a long time, formally and informally, and I think he makes a really important point. In this Budget we're not choosing resilience or reform, we're choosing resilience and reform. There will be economic reform in this Budget and that's because, even with the quite extreme global economic uncertainty that we're seeing, that's no reason to hit the pause button on some really important changes that we need to make. Now-
Gilbert:
The ambition is there, too? You've said that before, how ambitious are we talking about? Because there's been a view that the Prime Minister might be a bit more cautious and you are leaning in. Is that a fair assessment?
Chalmers:
I don't think that is a fair assessment. I mean, I detect from the Prime Minister and the Cabinet colleagues a lot of ambition when it comes to this Budget. Now, obviously, every single budget is impacted by the prevailing economic conditions, and this one in that regard won't be any different. It's more than the usual amount of global economic uncertainty, of course that will play out in our budget considerations. But the ambition is there, and the reform will be there in the Budget.
Gilbert:
And the spending cuts as well?
Chalmers:
There will be savings in the Budget. There'll be savings in the Budget, there will be tax reform, and there will also the efforts to make our economy more productive to lift the speed limit on the economy. What this Budget will do, it will balance the pressures in the near term with the obligations and intergenerational demands of the future. You'll see that in the Budget.
Gilbert:
On the lifting the speed limit, how do you do that?
Chalmers:
By making our economy more productive. What we discovered at the end of last year when the private sector recovered very quickly, business investment, dwelling investment and the like. It recovered quickly, we're growing well above 2percent, and we saw the return of some of those unwelcome inflationary pressures. So what we need to do is to make our economy more productive, more dynamic -
Gilbert:
Encouraging business to invest? That's a big part of it, isn't it?
Chalmers:
Encouraging business to invest. Yes, getting their compliance costs down, making it easier and faster to build houses, renewable energy, even in the context of meetings we're having today, data centres. Making sure that we're building what we need as fast as we can, making it easier for businesses to invest, trying to get their compliance costs down where we can, so that we make our economy more productive and dynamic and lift the speed limit on growth.
Gilbert:
The big gas giants and the energy giants are warning about their risk to investment if you introduce a windfall profit tax. Allegra Spender, other members of the crossbench have been urging you to do that. And in fact, Andrew Hastie said he's open to the idea. So, you've got political cover if you were to go along those lines. What's your read on that?
Chalmers:
We haven't changed our policy on that, or our position on that. I do acknowledge that there are a pretty broad spectrum of my views. Of course, the gas companies would say that in the context of this debate that is playing out publicly, and it will play out-
Gilbert:
Do you think they'd walk? Would they walk if this were to be implemented? Or is this just talk?
Chalmers:
It's a hypothetical, really, because obviously that would depend on a policy that a government implemented. But we haven't changed our policy on that. The Senate just agreed to a committee to look at some of these sorts of issues, to try and corral all these very different views that we're seeing from around the country and around the community. We haven't changed our policy. When it comes to the PRRT, reformed the PRRT so that these companies are paying more tax, sooner. That was the reform that I instituted in the course of the last term of the parliament, that means more businesses are paying sooner, that's a good thing.
Gilbert:
On the spend the spending restraint, will some people feel it? Often politicians, understandably, you don't want to create - winners, fine - but losers, not so much. Sometimes you have to do that in terms of making proper cuts.
Chalmers:
Obviously, we're always very attentive to the decisions that we take, their impact on real people in real communities, like those that we represent. We're obviously very careful about that. There will be savings in the Budget. Not everybody will support the kinds of difficult decisions that we have to take in every budget, including in this one. The onus is on us to explain why these changes are necessary, not just when it comes to savings, but tax reform as well, productivity as well. We will get through this difficult period if we all do our bit, and we will strengthen our economy into the future as well if we take some difficult decisions, and there'll be some of those in May.
Gilbert:
Europe is urging their member nations to avoid unnecessary travel, for their citizens to avoid unnecessary travel, to work from home where need be. Do you need to take that step to actually start making formal recommendations for people to do that? Or do you notice already people are doing it instinctively?
Chalmers:
I think people typically try and do the right thing. Now, we are not calling for people to cancel holidays, for example. We're definitely not suggesting that people shouldn't make the most of their Easter break. But I think a lot of families are working out the best way to take a little bit of the edge off these fuel prices. We're doing our bit with the excise cut, and families are making responsible decisions that work for them. Not every family has access, in the bush for example, to public transport. But my view generally about Australians is Australians try to do the right thing by each other, and I think that that's what they're trying to do right now, making sensible decisions about their own household budgets.
Gilbert:
You want to avoid the COVID‑style crackdown. But do you fear that we do end up in a situation where there will be hard rationing, where flights will be restricted? Is that where we're heading?
Chalmers:
First of all, this is a substantial economic shock but it's not the same as COVID. It's different to COVID. It warrants a different kind of response. And all of our effort, National Cabinet by the Prime Minister, all of our effort as a Cabinet and as a government is about doing what we responsibly can to avoid those heavier, harsher measures that we saw during COVID. We don't want to go down that path. And our ability to avoid harsher interventions in our economy and in our society rests on our ability to do what we can now. All of our efforts are about avoiding whether it be rationing or other kinds of interventions like that.
Gilbert:
On a couple of quick ones, I know you've got a meeting, but the fuel excise reduction was described by Chris Richardson as good politics, not good economics. What do you say to that?
Chalmers:
I'm not sure about that. I think what makes it responsible is that it's temporary. It's timely, it's temporary, it's targeted to motorists who are feeling the biggest pinch. I think that makes it responsible, and I understand that it's-
Gilbert:
And it's legislated that the use by date, it's done at that point.
Chalmers:
Yes. Obviously we keep all of our policies under more or less constant review. But it will be legislated to end at the end of June. It's 3months-
Gilbert:
When you say under review, you might keep it for another 3months?
Chalmers:
Not necessarily this policy, but across the board we always try and do the right thing and make sure that our economic policies match the economic conditions, and that's what we're doing here. I know Chris has a view about it, I respect Chris, but this is timely, it's temporary, it's targeted and that makes it responsible.
Gilbert:
Donald Trump's last Truth Social post, he says that in terms of allies, we won't be there to help you anymore. He's really lashed out at the likes of the UK and others that weren't there to support him when he called for allies to step up. And he says if you want to oil, go get your own oil in the Hormuz Strait. What do you make of his intervention?
Chalmers:
Look, I don't intend to respond in detail to every social media post from the President of the United States. Our focus is on the impacts of this war on the Australian people and the Australian economy. From an economic point of view, the end of the war in the Middle East can't come soon enough, but consequences will linger for a bit longer.
Gilbert:
Is the alliance damaged, though? I mean, I know the UK was mentioned explicitly, not Australia, but do you fear that? Because we are investing a lot in that relationship, as you know better than anyone.
Chalmers:
I wouldn't have thought so. The alliance is strong and the relationship is strong. Whether it be the steps we're taking in defence policy and defence procurement or in a whole range of other ways. I work really closely with my counterpart in the US, and so I wouldn't have thought so.
Gilbert:
Treasurer, thanks for your time.
Chalmers:
Thanks Kieran.
Disclaimer: Curated by HT Syndication.
