CANBERRA, ACT, April 24 -- The Prime Minister of Australia issued the following media release:
TIM LESTER, HOST:To answer our questions, who better than the Prime Minister Anthony Albanese, welcome to The Issue.
ANTHONY ALBANESE, PRIME MINISTER:Good to be with you.
LESTER:You're a newlywed in The Lodge. Now that's unique in and of itself. So, how is newlywed life going for you and Jodie with a war on in the Middle East and the threat of a global recession and everything else you've got to deal with for your day job?
PRIME MINISTER:Personally, it's going very well. And I'm very lucky to have found at my stage in life, for us to have found each other. And there is something incredibly comforting, of course, after a really difficult day, and no matter how much chaos there is that you are dealing with, and certainly, this is a very turbulent time globally, to be able to go home and spend time with each other, not enough. It must be said, at the current time, it's been so busy, but it is a great source of comfort and stability. The fact that Jodie and I have each other.
LESTER:Budget fast approaching. How important will this Budget be compared to the others that your Government's delivered?
PRIME MINISTER:They're all important, but this is, particularly, critical time, and it, of course, is our first Budget after the election. So, the first Budget of the second term. We had four budgets in our first term. So, this is dealing as well with challenging times. We're seeing global inflation spike as a result of the conflict in the Middle East. So, we need to get that balance right. We need to make sure that we continue to be fiscally responsible. There'll be a range of savings in the Budget, but also that we use it to set Australia up for the future. So, dealing with immediate issues, but in a way that helps to anticipate and indeed create the better future that we want to see.
LESTER:How important will it be to make sure that nothing in the May Budget harms the chances of young Australians from buying their first home?
PRIME MINISTER:Absolutely critical. I know the issues that Australia is facing, and indeed the world I think is facing, the advanced industrialised world, is intergenerational equity. The feeling that is there, that young people aren't getting a fair crack. And having the opportunity to have your own home is something that's so critical for people. My mother lived in the one public house that she was born in, was council housing and then became state department. She used to drum into me as a young boy, 'when you get the chance buy your own home.' That was seen as the Australian dream. Now I want to make sure that that is attainable for this and future generations of Australians.
LESTER:And yet, if you adjust negative gearing and Capital Gains Tax in the way that a lot of people speculate you will, aren't you going to make it tougher on young Australians to get a home?
PRIME MINISTER:No, nothing that we will do will make it tougher. What we are determined to do, of course, when it comes to housing, the key is supply. And so the range of measures that we have in place, whether it be increased public housing and social housing through the Housing Australia Future Fund, the Help to Buy scheme that is a shared equity scheme, so that people can get into home ownership with a share taken up, if you like, by government, and then buy them out later on down the track, has been very successful. It has been in place in Western Australia for 50 years. Or whether it is the 5 per cent deposits that have seen over 200,000 Australians get into their first home. But also, we want to work on intergenerational equity, which is why our tax cuts are aimed at that first marginal tax rate, by the automatic tax deductions, the cut by 20 per cent, to student debt, all of that is aimed at giving young people a better opportunity to get ahead.
LESTER:But on those two schemes, you mentioned both the shared equity and the 5 per cent deposit, you fiddle on demand side, not the supply side. In fact, one prominent Queensland property guru, Sam Gordon, said to us, 'they've got to concentrate on supply. It's the demand side, when they fiddle with it, they send demand through the roof. They help those who are already in the market, but they cruel the chances of young Australians to do better'.
PRIME MINISTER:Where he's wrong is that these are schemes that are aimed at first home buyers, by definition, that is giving them the opportunity. But of course, supply is the key. That's why programs like Build to Rent, which is about encouraging private sector rentals, so that you get that demand for supply up as well. That's why the Housing Accord that I have with state and territory governments - giving them a financial incentive to improve the supply of housing is critical, and also the program that we have where over half a billion dollars, but there's been additional since then, of helping local government, how do we get electricity, water, those essentials, roads - get that local infrastructure in to facilitate that building of homes as well, makes a substantial difference.
LESTER:Are you sure Australians get enough money for the energy resources we sell overseas, particularly our gas?
PRIME MINISTER:Well, there are a range of mechanisms have been put in place for some time. Could they have been better? Yes, of course, they could.
LESTER:The PRRT is a failure, isn't it?
PRIME MINISTER:That's not quite right. We made some improvements to the PRRT, but that's just one element. The PRRT is one element. But there's also company tax, and there's also the contributions made. And importantly, the PRRT is designed to ramp up how much revenue it creates as companies that have invested, in some cases, tens of billions of dollars in establishing the extraction infrastructure so that the offshore gas industry can be created. If you look at the amount of investment in something like the INPEX facility in Darwin, for example, is tens of billions of dollars. Now they, like other private sector operators, they need to get back their investment before they've made a single dollar. Now the PRRT is aimed at, once that occurs, it ramps up how much revenue will be received.
LESTER:According to The Australia Institute, it gets us about $2 billion a year, and the gas companies over the last four years have made $149 billion. Whole different quantum.
PRIME MINISTER:Well the Australia Institute have an agenda. And it's good that this debate take place, but it's also important there be a bit of honesty in the debate as well. So that, for example, in the last full financial year, 2024-25 there was $22 billion of tax paid by the gas sector. Now you can argue that should be more, by all means, but what you shouldn't do is have a debate where you just dismiss that and don't give that any consideration, because that is a fact, just the same as the amount of investment which is made in order to create those industries, is a fact as well. So, one of the things that I've said - could it have been designed better from the beginning? Yes, absolutely. But Australia will also be a country where, if we have a contract with suppliers or with countries, businesses, anywhere, we stick to our word. Now that's essential for the way that trade operates and essential for Australia's standing as well.
LESTER:What would a gas tax now do to our relations with Malaysia, South Korea, Singapore, even China, who, of course, all send us liquid fuels?
PRIME MINISTER:What we have made very clear is that regardless of any debates that are taking place here, we honour contracts. That is what we do as a country.Let's have a debate that's based upon facts, rather than, for example, some of the rhetoric that's come out, for example, about beer tax somehow being the same level as gas tax.
LESTER: Is that wrong?
PRIME MINISTER:It's just complete fantasy, and the people who are advocating it should actually stick to facts. There are arguments, of course, that are legitimate arguments about Australia getting its fair share from what are our resources. I want to see that as well. But I want to debate based upon facts.
LESTER:Short term fuel supplies look pretty good. In fact, better than the day that the Iran War broke out, I think. What about beyond June?
PRIME MINISTER:What we can do is project from about four to six weeks. How many ships are on the water? What supply is coming. There'll be figures that I received just this morning that are positive as well about the amount of diesel and jet fuel in particular, that is on its way to Australia that's contracted. That's a good thing. We have two new announcements today of cargoes that have been secured in additional supply through Export Finance Australia. One of those through BP, importantly, will provide 50 million litres of diesel, and that will be going to Townsville, Mackay and Gladstone, so particularly important for helping industry. And the other is Ampol, have secured another cargo as well, again, 50 million litres of diesel that will be going to Sydney and will help people in those regional communities as well. We use twice as much diesel as we do petrol in this country. It's inelastic because it's necessary for agriculture, for resources, for industry, for manufacturing, and that's why we've been particularly concentrating now, we will have secured through Export Finance Australia 400 million litres of additional diesel, and that's a positive thing.
LESTER:And we do use a lot of diesel, about 95 million litres a day. Nobody would scoff at the fuel you've managed to entice off the spot market to Australia, but that whole 400 million litres is under five days, if my calculations are right. Doesn't that give us a sense of the scale of the threat here, how big a fuel crisis could be, how damaging it could be?
PRIME MINISTER:This is a serious issue, Tim. And we've made it very clear, and I did that in my National Address as well, said that we're preparing for what could be very difficult circumstances, depending upon how long this war goes for, every day creates more of an overhang, and means that the economic consequences won't end the day that the war ends.
LESTER:New South Wales farmers today suggesting that grocery prices, particularly vegetables, might jump 50 per cent in cost very soon. Do we need to brace for serious increases in the price of our food?
PRIME MINISTER:There will be an inflationary impact because of the increased price of diesel -
LESTER:That's more than inflation?
PRIME MINISTER:I'm not in a position to comment on what the New South Wales farmers or people say on a specific, but what I can say in general is that there will be an inflationary impact of what has occurred, but in part because of, I think, the Government action that we've taken, petrol prices today are about 10 to 15 cents more than they were at the beginning of this conflict. Now, that's 10 to 15 cents more than we would like to see, but it's relatively much better than where it was. Diesel, though, there's ongoing pressure on prices, and that will create pressure on inflation.
LESTER:But do we have a sense here that we haven't seen anything yet? That if this war drags on, the pain will be far sharper than anything we've seen in the first six to eight weeks?
PRIME MINISTER:What we certainly have is uncertainty, and that is something that - I would like to be able to say we know exactly how this is going to play out. The truth is that no one can say that, because we don't know how long this conflict will go for. We don't know what the impact, for example, of the damage to infrastructure in the Gulf has been. We don't know the consequences for the clearing of the Strait, if it ended tomorrow, clearing of sea mines, how long that would take. But what we can say with certainty is that we are throwing everything at this. We're engaging as we speak here, there's meetings going on in London about clearing of the Strait, about the cooperation under the leadership of UK and France, and the Europeans.
LESTER:And we want to be in on that right?
PRIME MINISTER:Absolutely, we can say with certainty that we're out there in the marketplace, using every asset at our disposal to try to secure more supply as well. And we have made the decision, of course, to reduce the fuel excise by half. That has made a difference as well.
LESTER:What's your thinking, your latest thinking on how Australia might contribute to a post-war mission to keep the Strait open?
PRIME MINISTER:We have our E-7 Wedgetail aircraft there in the region.
LESTER:So, it could join?
PRIME MINISTER:That's making a difference. It provides for defensive security as well. So, we've extended its period of service, and we've had a changeover of personnel there as well, who operate what is an extraordinary facility. And that has made a substantial difference. We're engaged diplomatically as well, and we will always do what we can to make a positive difference -
LESTER:Probably not a naval contribution though?
PRIME MINISTER:I think it would be unlikely that that would be requested, given how close the Europeans are, and the expertise in particular that the Europeans have, the Italians to name one country, and when we had the phone video meeting a week ago, Giorgia Meloni spoke about the expertise that the Italian Navy have in clearing sea mines as well. That's something that the Europeans are in a strong position, through NATO, to be able to assist with.
LESTER:A report yesterday said that your Government had spoken to oil companies or energy companies earlier this month to feel out the possibility of building a third refinery in Australia. Was it discussed?
PRIME MINISTER:Look, we don't reach out. There's been some speculation of ideas. What we've said very clearly, Tim, is that we're open for ideas. If people have commercial opportunities to create greater security here in Australia, then we are certainly open to having those conversations.
LESTER:And has that idea been put in?
PRIME MINISTER:Not in any detail at all. At this stage, it's very much down the track. Is it possible for some of the facilities that in the past have created fuel security, is it possible for them to be refitted? Is it possible for new facilities? There's a range of, at a time like this, there's a range of proposals coming forward, most of them, of course, long term, by definition. What our concentration has been has been on the immediate, immediate supply.
LESTER:Have you got an instinct on whether that would ever be feasible or not?
PRIME MINISTER:Look, I'm open for - these things need to be commercial arrangements, and we're open for working with the private sector.
LESTER:Seven Spotlight this last week, ran a piece that talked about the move to renewables from fossil fuels, and it raised the suggestion that with renewables, we might actually, far from freeing ourselves, be moving to a situation where China runs the EVs or sells us all our EVs. China sells us the wind turbines, China mines the cobalt. China has control of the process. With renewables, are we moving from the slave masters of the fossil fuel producers to the slave masters of the new electric world?
PRIME MINISTER:Not at all. The opposite is the case, Tim. The Solar Sunshot program is aiming at, and is successfully in both New South Wales and South Australia, seeing more solar panels built here. I want to see wind turbines built here as well.
LESTER:They will be, do you think?
PRIME MINISTER: Absolutely. I want to see the steel industry to be able to decarbonise and operate here. The whole critical minerals and rare earths industries will provide us with a once in a generation opportunity to make more things here. That's what the whole Future Made in Australia agenda is about, making more things here, making sure that we're less vulnerable to global shocks. And in the recent period, we have seen a global financial crisis. Then we saw Covid, and now we're seeing a conflict - firstly, we had the Russian invasion of Ukraine, had an impact, and now this global conflict. I want to see Australia be less vulnerable for international shocks, and the way that we do that is by making more things here in Australia, making sure that we strengthen our sovereign capacity right here, and that is what we are doing.
LESTER:So, what does the Strait of Hormuz tell us about our transition to renewables? Some argue that it means we've gone too fast, that we should have kept the infrastructure around fossil fuels, the old infrastructure, and that we need it now. Others say we should have gone faster. We should be further into renewables and less attached to the masters of the old oil world. What's right?
PRIME MINISTER:The transition is occurring, and it's a global transition that is occurring as well, to deal with the challenge of climate change, but also to deal with the economic opportunities which are there. There is no one who has bought an EV who's regretting that decision today. And what we've seen, for example, from the batteries rollout is some 330,000 Australians take up the opportunity - probably more because it's growing each day - take up the opportunity to capture the solar energy that is on their rooftop solar, make sure as well that they can use that energy during peak periods. And that has benefited them. For many of them, taking them out of paying energy bills permanently. But importantly as well, it's helped everyone because it takes pressure off the grid and allows for, particularly at peak times, for a difference to be made for the energy needed through the national system. So, measures like that are a way forward for Australia. At the same time, should we have shut down all of the refineries? I agree that we certainly should not have done that. We need gas in this country as part of, as well, firming up renewables. We need to continue to have an orderly transition. That is what I have been about and that is what my Government is focused on as well.
LESTER:A couple of questions to close. Donald Trump launched this war and gave you and other allies no warning, cruelled global fuel supplies in doing so, the fuel we need to feed ourselves. And apparently didn't weigh that Iran might shut off oil out of the Strait of Hormuz. How much faith should we have in America's global leadership after this?
PRIME MINISTER:Well, we live in a turbulent world. There are two great superpowers that have strategic competition in our region, the United States and China. The United States is a democracy. It's our most important ally. But they made this decision by themselves or with Israel. They didn't consult us at the time. That's their right to do so as a sovereign state.
LESTER:But a bad decision, surely?
PRIME MINISTER:Well, what we've done is continued to engage with our friends in the United States. We've continued to call for a de-escalation. We want to see an endpoint to this conflict. And we know that the longer it goes on, the greater the impact, particularly in our region, particularly in the Asian region, it will have.
LESTER:Right. Doesn't it underscore though that Mark Carney, the Leader in Canada, is right when he talks about Australia and other countries looking for other friends? Not necessarily shunning the US, but doesn't it show that we got to move out in the world to make new friends, new security partners?
PRIME MINISTER:We do that with the engagement that we're having in our region. If you look at the priority that we've had, we've kept the US alliance strong. The AUKUS arrangements are full steam ahead in the words of President Trump. And the US is also an important economic relationship that we have. I had the Microsoft CEO here just yesterday and announcing $25 billion of investment here in Australia. But we've also, one of the first things I've done is to reach out to the ASEAN countries in our region. Nicholas Moore did the Southeast Asia Economic Strategy to 2040, that has worked with countries - part of the dividend that we've seen paid in the last difficult weeks has been our relationship with Indonesia, it meant I could thank President Prabowo for providing through Indonesia to Incitec, a company here, 250,000 tonnes of additional fertiliser, urea, that we need. The increased supply from Malaysia, Singapore, and Brunei, countries I was able to visit, that I have relationships with in the region as well. The European Free Trade Agreement that we signed here just weeks ago with Ursula von der Leyen during her visit and Address to the Parliament, that relationship is so important as well. So, right throughout our region indeed around the world, middle powers are engaging. Mark Carney visited and spoke here in the Parliament.
LESTER:So, you agree with the need to look for friends, more solid friendships that have nothing to do with the United States?
PRIME MINISTER:No, I think that the United States relationship will be our most important security relationship, but that doesn't mean that it's an exclusive relationship. This isn't a monogamous relationship between Australia and the United States. Australia is also, if you like, we're out there dating in our region. ASEAN, the Pacific Island Forum with the G7 participation that I had in Canada and Japan. We are friends as well of NATO and have participated in NATO forums. And we are a serious middle power. We punch above our weight. There is no country in the world you'd rather be than Australia. And we're highly regarded and respected. We have a stable political system, legal system, and economic system compared with just about anywhere in the world. And that's a positive thing for us.
LESTER:Before I ask a closing question, an extraordinary announcement on the NDIS in the last couple of days. What's your message to the 160,000 Australians who now have cover, who by the end of the decade won't have cover? What do you say to them?
PRIME MINISTER:My message is that what we are committed to absolutely is making the NDIS a system that we can continue to be proud of, that's sustainable into the future, that we won't leave people behind, that we want to make sure that every Australian gets the care that they need and that they deserve. But we inherited a system that was growing at 22 per cent, and that would have seen the entire system lose that social licence that taxpayers expect when you have that sort of growth.
LESTER:You really are saving the NDIS.
PRIME MINISTER:We are absolutely saving the NDIS. Were we to sit back and say, 'we'll just let this roll on,' then it would have been vulnerable. Because you have a social program that is so important, that has transformed lives and that will continue to do so, and that the growth in the NDS funding will continue. We're not talking about cuts. We're talking about growth of 2 per cent to the end of the decade and then 5 per cent beyond that, but that a system that was going to cost more than Medicare and the PBS combined, more than anything except for the Age Pension, simply couldn't be allowed to operate in the way that it was never intended to. It was never intended to be what it has been in some cases, some cases left to happen.
LESTER:Last question. We passed an anniversary in January that think is worth noting in this office. It's 60 years since an Australian Prime Minister left the job of Prime Minister voluntarily. Everyone in the years since Robert Menzies has been booted by their party, booted by the voters, and one was booted by God, died in office. Do you plan to leave this job voluntarily or are you going to get booted like everybody else?
PRIME MINISTER:I certainly hope to be in that position, but that of course -
LESTER:That needs planning though, right? That's not an accident. That needs something thought.
PRIME MINISTER:That of course is a matter for the Australian people.
LESTER:Well, retirement's a matter for you though, isn't it?
PRIME MINISTER:One of the positives - look, Tim, this is a tough job, but it's one that I am immensely proud and honoured to fulfil. We've known each other a while. I think when we first met, if you would have said to me, 'Do you want to be Prime Minister?' I didn't come here with that sense of destiny that I know some people have, and that's fine. I thought at the time I ran for the leadership of the Labor Party that I was the best person to do so. And my colleagues in 2019 and the party in 2019 agreed with me, and I had a plan to get us into government and then a plan to secure an increased majority and we achieved that. I'm enjoying this job, but I don't take it for granted at all.
LESTER:No, but do you have an active plan? I know you're not going to say, 'I'm leaving on this date.' Of course you can't, but do you have an active plan to leave it under your own steam?
PRIME MINISTER:I don't have a plan beyond getting to the Budget, getting to the rest of this term. I intend certainly to be a candidate at the 2028 Election. I think that is important that there be some consistency as well. Were I to think that wasn't in the national interest, then I would change that position. But I think for a long while, one of the things holding back Australia from that engagement we were just talking about with the rest of the world was the revolving door of prime ministerships where Prime Ministers Rudd ,Gillard, Abbott, and Turnbull were replaced during a term, having been elected. And then I'm the first person since John Howard to be re-elected having served a full term. I think that is a good thing and the stability that my Government has been able to provide. We have had one Foreign Minister, one Defence Minister, one Treasurer, one Finance Minister, one Prime Minister, has been a good thing. Working with business, working with unions, working with civil society, the relationships that you build globally as well in our interconnected world, all of that produces better outcomes for Australia. And the truth is that my mentor as well said to me, there are two things, Tom Uren used to drum this into me. Two things you've got to do. You've got to learn something new every day, and I certainly continue to do that. And you've got to get better as a person as well. You've got to grow as a person every day in how you interact and how you consider your professional and personal life as well. And I try to do that each and every day as well.
LESTER:Anthony Albanese, thank you for tackling The Issue.
PRIME MINISTER:Thanks, Tim.
Disclaimer: Curated by HT Syndication.
